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Gentoo-users flamage - nil.enroll(aetheric_username, quantum_class_id)
yljatlhQo'! QIch lo'laltbebej!
adric
adric
Gentoo-users flamage
Thread here: http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.user/101079

Subject: Unsafe for production use. was Re: etc-update Noob mistake

Innocent bystander @...co.uk writes:

>
> On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 08:47:21 -0500, Jeff Smelser wrote:
>
> > FYI, you can change etc-update to confirm if you want it rm/mv the
> > file just like that.. ;)
>
> Yeah, but like you said, this isn't really an etc-update problem...
>

No, from reading this thread (linked from weekly news) I'd have to say it's an _attitude_ problem. A n00b writes in with a question about why the software update proceedure he was told to run made his system not boot. A few helpful voices urge the noob not to reformat and reinstall and offer to help in IRC. If only it had ended there.

Cries of "Oh, not that again" and "That one got me once, but you'll learn" and "You've got backups, right?" and even "Just pop the LiveCD back in, and fix it, man" are heard. Explanations of why this is a design fsckup in the OS in question are shouted down by egotistical power-users who want everyone to repeat the mistakes they had to to make, and by people pointing out that the n00b made the wrong choice, tough. Any discussion of how to fix this obviously recurring problem dissappates.

Put me down for fixing base layout, and re-examining how portage (doesn't) handle config files. To see how it could be done less poorly look at Debian policy or FreeBSD's mergemaster Mergemaster does what some posters in this thread seem to think etc-update can do. For instance rather than drawing an integer number line from -1 to -5 and asking the user to guess, mergemaster actually has online help (hit ? [enter]) which explains how to merge or ignore changes.

Also, don't worry about me running Gentoo for production. If I want my weekly software patch run on a production webserver colocated offsite to result in a non-booting system and a trip to the NOC (to use that LiveCD ;) I'll just use RedHat or Windows, thanks. In all my fat-fingered absente mindedness I have never been able to break a Debian or FreeBSD box that badly just by patching it. Wow.

/dev/ROOT / XFS
[etc]

HTH,
adric
3 comments or Leave a comment
Comments
From: ptwarhol Date: October 4th, 2004 08:05 pm (UTC) (Link)

Rick

I need your help. 678-851-8980
not_hothead_yet From: not_hothead_yet Date: January 14th, 2005 01:48 pm (UTC) (Link)
this made me laugh.

Maybe I'm mistaken about what is/was going on?

Personally, (without bothering to read thread linked) I must say that I'd guess something sinister or just user ignorance. I have yet to have an update problem so severe that reboot couldn't fix it. My first question, as a social engineering pro-wannabe would be "have you been allowing pop-up?" Cuz that's almost always the base. Even the savvyest succumb.

*laughs some more*
not_hothead_yet From: not_hothead_yet Date: January 14th, 2005 02:02 pm (UTC) (Link)
Just read it.... fascinating stuff.
Is it typical to advise the OP on how to do it "better" in the future especially when recommending a different OS altogether?

From the glimmer of understanding that I got, I'd agree with what you suggest with the exception of suggesting different format to begin with (only because "too late" kinda comes to mind as well as knowing how even n00bs cling to their favorite software)

-Happy WinX pirate
3 comments or Leave a comment